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Episode Summary

I had the pleasure of meeting Josh Paul, a former Director at the State Department overseeing U.S. defence diplomacy and global arms transfers, including Israel.

Today, Josh is one of the world’s most avid human rights campaigners, exposing how the US is not just “involved” in the Israel-Palestine conflict, but rather actively shaping the outcome through military support, political cover, and a long habit of avoiding real accountability.

From his perspective as an insider, this position has turned policy into a moral and legal failure, not just a strategic one. But what stood out to me is his insistence that this was never an inevitable stance on Israel. It was a choice!

He points to moments when US pressure actually changed Israeli behaviour, which means leverage still exists. But, as we have witnessed recently with Joe Biden and now Donald Trump, it has been ignored and left unused.

This part is critically important because it shifts the conversation from the apparent public perception of helplessness to one of responsibility. Josh also makes it clear that public opinion is moving, especially among younger people and on social media, and that the old bipartisan consensus is starting to crack.

We discuss how, in today’s political climate, the landscape is changing, and the next few years could decide whether the US continues to support the same cycle or finally demands consequences. Interestingly, Josh suggested that Trump might be the one president who will break this cycle due to his frustration with the failed Iran war.

But I also sense a warning in what he says about the growing overlap of technology, AI, and military power in Israel. That mix raises the stakes far beyond a single conflict because it links human rights, surveillance, and global security in a way that is impossible to overlook.

Join the conversation with Josh and me and hear the arguments about how the status quo is not neutral, not sustainable, and not morally defensible — but it is still changeable if the wider public pushes hard enough.

Key Takeaways

(YouTube Timestamps)
  • 00:00:00 – Preview
  • 00:03:33 – Josh Paul’s explosive resignation under Biden and the impact of U.S. policy on Israel
  • 00:11:41 – Biden’s ideological stance on Israel and its legal implications leading to the genocide in Gaza
  • 00:16:55 – Could the U.S. ever stop Israel from committing war crimes and sanction its government?
  • 00:19:58 – The Role of AIPAC in influencing politics in the U.S. and Europe
  • 00:22:45 – Corporate media’s and social media platforms’ role in shaping and reshaping the public perception of Israel and the Palestinians
  • 00:28:34 – What had caused the apparent mass radicalisation of the Israeli society, particularly their younger generations
  • 00:37:06 – Will there ever be peace in the Middle East?
  • 00:40:32 – How the Iran war may force the Trump Administration to stop or sanction Israel
  • 00:42:49 – The anti-corruption and anti-Epstein class populism and the changing political landscape
  • 00:53:16 – The impact of Elon Musk’s DOGE on civil service and global security, with a potential criminal-level of overreach, manslaughter and corruption
  • 00:59:20 – What would a new policy for Palestine look like and how will Josh and his organisation implement it?
  • 01:08:21 – Josh’s call for the business community’s and civil servants’ role in advocacy. Stop your “neutrality” excuses!
  • 01:12:58 – The role of the tech sector and AI labs in propping up Israel’s military threats throughout the Middle East and beyond
  • 01:20:11 – Defining success in advocacy and campaigning for human rights

Our Favourite Quote

If there is something that is so blatantly being ignored, set aside by the executive, that is not going to be the only time in which the executive decides not to apply the law.

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